Topic : Salcombe entries and certificates

Hi all, This time in 4 weeks we will all be thinking about packing for Salcombe week and what a fab week we shall have. To save spoiling it at the outset this is a quick reminder that we will be checking certificates (for real this year!). To help you out I have been through the class records and the entry list and confired with the RYA and the following boats either have no certificate or incorrect ownership registered. These need to be sorted before registration at Salcombe please.

3146 - Out of date ownership records
3402 - Out of date ownership records
3451 - Out of date ownership records
3559 - Out of date ownership records
3560 - Out of date ownership records
3599 - Out of date ownership records
3606 - Out of date ownership records
3633 - Out of date ownership records
3649 - Out of date ownership records
3650 - Out of date ownership records
3657 - Out of date ownership records
3658 - Out of date ownership records
3678 - Out of date ownership records
3682 - Out of date ownership records
3684 - Out of date ownership records
3696 - No registered Owner
3698 - Out of date ownership records
3734 - No Certificate registered yet (New Boat)

This is by no means an exercise to name and shame those who have not renewed as a number of these boats have changed hands in the past 6 months and have simply not updated or do not realise you need to. There are many more that are in this situation but simply have not entered Salcombe Week.

There are a number of people entered without a boat who I guess will be borrowing one. Could you please also borrow the certificate or a bring a copy and make sure the owners details are on it.

Whilst doing this you may also like to update your bouyancy endorsments. This can be signed off by a senior member of your club or the association.

This all goes for the Championship entries too although I have not yet got that list!

Many thanks for making this as easy as possible for everyone.

Keeper of Class records

Posted: 06/06/2012 12:19:18
By: Jez3645
It has been brought to my attention that at least one of these boats has already updated and received their new Certificate from the RYA, however the RYA do not seem to have updated their own records. The owner has sent me a copy of said certificate for my records and he is now up to date as far as I am concerned.

If any of the other boats on the list also think they should not be on there please let drop me an email and I will raise it with the RYA and ask you to scan me a copy or send me a photo copy for my records.

This is important and I would like to be satisfied with all of these before salcombe.

3658 - now satisfied.

3696 - Alan your address details are on yours but your name is not. Please can you contact the RYA and let them kow who you are!!! Your certificate is not valid without your name on it and they will not take my word for it.

Thanks again everyone.

Posted: 07/06/2012 10:42:09
By: Jez3645
3541 & 3698 being actioned. Thank you.

For the rest of you the questions I am being asked:

All you need to do is send a letter with your boat number and your details on it stating that you are the new owner of the boat and what club it will be sailed from. Send a cheque with it for £25.53 payable to the RYA.
Send it to:

Andy Wibroe
RYA Technical Unit,
RYA House,
Ensign Way,
SO31 4YA

He will do the rest and send you a new certificate and me a copy.

Simple as that. I know it is another £25 but it is only once and a small price to pay to enjoy such fantastic sailing and partying to the worlds best sailing dinghy!!

Posted: 11/06/2012 10:42:03
By: Jez3645
do you need to include the original certificate?

Posted: 11/06/2012 10:50:09
By: Dave
I would say it makes Andy's job a little easier but it is not essential. He has a record of all the certificates anyway.

Posted: 11/06/2012 10:53:36
By: Jez3645
Reading the small print on the RYA site
RYA Gold Card Members get one free certificate per calender year.
Lucky me!

Posted: 11/06/2012 13:12:27
By: Jon (3682)
Better stop changing your boat so often then Jon!!

Can I take it that you have sent off for your new one then?

Posted: 11/06/2012 13:27:21
By: Jez3645
Sure thing Jez. Sent mine off to sir on Sunday.
Hopefully be out of the naughty corner in time!
BTW I'm hopeing to work on a another wooden one soon.
Cracker is being sailed regularly now at our club and providing some good competition.

Posted: 11/06/2012 14:20:28
By: Jon (3682)
Excellent, did you sell Chracker in the end then? I thought you where keeping her? Lovely, you should post some pictures of the new one as it progresses, people seem to like to follow them.

Thanks for getting the certificate done.

Posted: 11/06/2012 16:09:12
By: Jez3645
Not sold just loned on a permenant basis.
I always take pictures for future reference and fond memories.

Posted: 11/06/2012 19:20:21
By: Jon (3682)
How often does the buoyancy endorsement need to be done? Is it every year?

Posted: 12/06/2012 09:18:39
By: John Buckley
Yes, Officially they should be done annually. With these modern moulded boats it has become a little less important and so there is no actual test anymore. All you need is for a club official or association official to vouch for you. I would be happy with a respected long standing member of the class too.

Posted: 12/06/2012 10:20:31
By: Jez3645
I would be gratefull if you could let me know when you have applied for your new certificate so I know where we stand.

If you are lending your boat please make sure you give your certificate too, or at lease a copy otherwise there is little point in lending it!!

Posted: 12/06/2012 10:24:59
By: Jez3645
‘Interesting’ bump in the RYA defined buoyancy endorsement process.  The buoyancy endorsement can only be signed by the owner.  So if you lend your boat you need to make sure you’ve signed the endorsement.  If the bloke you lend the boat to turns up to an event without it there’s nothing they can do to get it sorted, in the olden days a friendly measurers or club official could sort it.

Posted: 12/06/2012 11:57:21
By: N12
Sorry, you are right that the owner needs to sign it, but it then needs to be 'witnessed' by an official. That is my understanding of it anyway.

Posted: 12/06/2012 12:42:14
By: Jez3645

All on the case.

Let not but a few let the side down....

Posted: 12/06/2012 16:40:55
By: Jez3645
Apologies in advance

Posted: 12/06/2012 17:27:34
By: Rebel
Posting mine tomorrow

Posted: 12/06/2012 17:46:08
By: Richard (3233)
Must have missed you off the list Richard, unless you have only just entered. 
Thanks for getting it sorted.

Posted: 12/06/2012 17:48:42
By: Jez3645
Mine went into the post today :)
I do have a copy of it just incase the RYA can't cope with the sudden influx of new certificate requests!

Posted: 12/06/2012 17:52:42
Cheers Martin. I hope they do have an influx!! Missed you off my list too for some reason. Think I am going to have to go through it again!

Posted: 13/06/2012 09:02:44
By: Jez3645
Deep Thought's in the post today

Posted: 13/06/2012 09:59:01
By: Martin & Jemma 3451
Jeremy - yes, only just entered last week.

Posted: 13/06/2012 11:30:23
By: Richard (3233)
There is a couple more boats that havecome to my attention.

3723 - out of date ownership records.
3288 - This boat is being borrowed but the Helm will still need to produce a valid certificate in the owners name. (I have been contacted about this and advised so)

Posted: 14/06/2012 10:34:34
By: Jez3645
Sailor, So who is sailing your boat ?

Posted: 14/06/2012 11:31:15
By: RH .
3723 confirmed that it is being dealt with.

There are now just 9 boats left that I have not heard from (you know who you are).

This time in 3 weeks we will be packing ready to leave and it will be too late.

Out of this 9 boats 4 are from Tamesis and 2 or 3 from Blithfield. Could I ask that the relevant class captians give their class members a bit of a nudge to remind them.

Thanks you very much.

Posted: 14/06/2012 13:58:23
By: Jez3645
Mr jez, how come you are in a position to say that a 30 yr old boat doesn't have a certificate when the owner has one issued by the RYA with every sticker on it for the last 30 years. What is your source?

Posted: 14/06/2012 18:47:26
By: Phil

Has the owner in question had the boat for 30 years themselves? Certificates have to be renewed when boats change hands (see link).

Posted: 14/06/2012 19:03:10
By: Chris B
Thanks Chris b but the question was to mt Jezebel not the floor. How come he has no record when the certificate is physical and has been for 30 years. What is his source?

Posted: 14/06/2012 19:45:35
By: Phil
Posted today for 3650.

Posted: 14/06/2012 20:14:45
By: Rich adams
3146 being posted tomorrow

Posted: 14/06/2012 21:05:53
By: Luke
phil, my source is Andy Wibroe in the Tech Dept at the RYA. So you have a certificate for your boat with your name on it? If you have then scan it in or post me a copy and I will raise it with the RYA as i have for another member. If, however, it has the previous owners name on it, it is not worth the paper it is written on. Sorry.

Posted: 14/06/2012 22:01:16
By: Jez3645
Thanks Luke, thanks Rich, i hope you get your mast sorted.

Posted: 14/06/2012 22:02:48
By: Jez3645
Oh, and by the way philys, my name is Jez, not Jezebel!

Posted: 14/06/2012 22:04:20
By: Jez3645
Thanks for the info JEZ, I am surprised RYA are allowed to pass on this personal info. The certificate is most certainly not in my name , that would required some administration , but I was surprised that RYA had no record of certification when I clearly have one..

Posted: 15/06/2012 09:40:15
By: Phil
It sounds to me like you are having a go at Jez when he is trying to help you out. Would you have sorted your certificate out if he hadn't contacted you about it? As if you hadn't then you would have turned up at Salcombe for nothing more than a week of spectating.

Also I don't think it is unreasonable for our class association to have access to certifiacte records as this is vital data to the class for historical and current reasons. Also the data they recieve would not include anything you hadn't already told the association when you joined anyway!

Posted: 15/06/2012 09:55:44
By: Alex 3556
Sadly cant make Salcombe and Jez seems to be doing a great job - its just that for some of us who have spent our lives 'railing against authority' (or the facile acceptance of authority) it all seems a bit draconian - dont worry, most of us will get over it! best etc

Posted: 15/06/2012 10:09:26
By: ludite
Alex, no having a go, not going to sallcombe, and no would not have updated ther's not particulary high on my agenda, and I dontbreallybthink it would have stopped me sailing..come on, it's just a fun family sailing week

Posted: 15/06/2012 10:16:48
By: Phil
Phil, the chances are that if the certificate you have is over 30 years old they don't keep records that long. As keeper of the class records it is my responsability to maintain a record of all the boats that are part of our class. Sadly these records are out of date and when they are up to date I will have a copy of all up to date Certificates. However, I only get sent copies when they are renewed by the RYA and so if yours has not been renewed for 30 years I will not have a copy. It is also a legal resposability for all boat owners to register their boats with the RYA in order to sail them in the class.

It may seen draconian to be asking this but if everyone updated the certificates when they bought their boats, as they would when they bought their cars, I would not have to ask.

What I would add is that this is not only a directive of the Class but of the RYA and had it not been for the intervention of the Committee last year allot of people would have been DSQ'd. I am trying to stop that from happening this year, hence the warning in the Spring Magazine, The Year book and on this Forum or is that not enough warning?????

I must thank all those people that have taken this on board without a bad word and just got on with it, even if you think I am nagging!!

We are now down to only 7 boats that I have not had commitment from for an up to date certificate.


I am trying to get in contact with each and everyone directly or via class captains but if you know the owners of these boats please let them know what they need to do.

Thanks again for all your help.

Posted: 15/06/2012 10:27:21
By: Jez3645
Come on people give Jeremy a chance and great credit for taking his own time to get the class records up to date and the class in good order. To keep us honest.
There are now two current posts "Rule 42" and "certificates" that indicate that the class does not really mind about rule observance!
Lets just do it.
Jez is doing a job for us that is long overdue.
Two of the boats Jez's honours list are from two old Merlin Families and it may be the RYA thats records are at fault.
Thank you Jeremy.

Posted: 15/06/2012 11:31:49
By: Oldie
Thank you for the recognition.

You are right that two are from the well known Merlin families. One is an over sight by the owner I am sure. The other has two boats both of which do not have certificates!!

Posted: 15/06/2012 11:41:57
By: Jez3645
Sorry that should read 'Current Certificates'

Posted: 15/06/2012 11:43:00
By: Jez3645
Got mine back today from the RYA.
Only took 5 days to turn around and with the Olympics on that's quite remarkable!

Posted: 15/06/2012 12:12:27
By: Jon (3682)
Jez, keep up the good work, I don't really sail anymore so it's all a bit off my radar. I think you are doing a splendid job.

Posted: 15/06/2012 12:12:37
By: Phil
Thanks Phil, and thank you for lending your boat out too.

Posted: 15/06/2012 12:23:52
By: Jez3645
Three days turn round, posted 12:10 Tuesday recieved today!

Posted: 15/06/2012 18:30:35
3146 posted

Posted: 15/06/2012 18:33:43
By: Luke
Seems that you got a lot of boats up to date , well done Mr Deacon, paperwork is very important that its all in place

Posted: 16/06/2012 08:12:17
By: Martin Hunter
Very True Martin. I got yours through Yesterday!!

Posted: 16/06/2012 08:51:42
By: Jez3645
3599 Posted Yesterday

Posted: 16/06/2012 10:05:27
By: Ken D
Thanks Ken.

Posted: 16/06/2012 10:22:34
By: Jez3645
Jez, - got 3451's new Certificate back on Friday(3 day turnaround).

Posted: 18/06/2012 09:59:59
By: Martin & Jemma 3451
Thanks Guys. Andy is doing an excellent job in turning these around.

I have also been asked for clarification on the Bouyancy Endorsment Rules so here you are:

Referring to the current class rules (Rule 16)

Both the initial and the annual endorsements are to be signed by the owner on the measurement form/ certificate and witnessed by a club/ class official. Except where the owner is under 14 the signature shall be of the parent or guardian.

I hope that helps everyone.

Posted: 18/06/2012 15:51:25
By: Jez3645
Just spotted this topic - I'm the owner of 3657 you're trying to hunt down.... I will get the certificate update sorted this weekend - hopefully it'll be turned around before Merlin Week.  Sorry for the trouble, I'm useless with admin!!

Posted: 19/06/2012 21:49:09
By: Anthony Lofts
As long as you have the chance o get it sorted, which you have. That is my aim. Thanks.

Posted: 20/06/2012 08:41:48
By: Jez3645
Just over a week to go now and this is likely to be your last chance to get these Certificates sorted. Most people have been very posative about this and I am sure we will not have to much of a problem, however there is still a couple outstanding.

3402 - Rob Kennaugh
3560 - Stuart Jenkins
3649 - Andrew Harris

I have put names to boat numbers now purely so as those who know them can tell them they are on here and warn them.

There are also a couple of newly purchased boats on the list which are not likely to have a new certificate, however there is no reason it cannot have been aplied for. If your boat is brand new please keep a photocopy of your signed measurement forms when you send them off as these will sufice for the moment.

Borrowed boats will also need current certificates so don't forget to remind your owners!

Now the nasty bit.

If you are not able to provide an upto date certificate at registration, please bring your cheque book!! I have produced a form for you to fill in so I can forward it, with a cheque, to the RYA on your behalf. If you are not able to do this then as a last resort you will be listed as DSQ in the results for each race upto the day you do fill in the form and hand me a cheque. You will not be reinstated in the previous results but will score from that point onwards.

This is not a threat, it is a promise. You have all been given enough warning.

Sorry if this sounds draconian, but it is an important piece of paper and is only fair to those who have made the effort to be legal!

Happy Sailing, see you at salcombe.

Oh and don't forget to get your Buoyancy Endorsment updated (I am happy to sign off pretty much everyone who came to Whitstable!!)

Posted: 26/06/2012 15:12:18
By: Jez3645
3560 in post to RYA

Posted: 26/06/2012 20:37:51
Jez's post deleted by request.

3 boats still have outstanding paperwork. I'd have thought they know who they are!

If you have not got a certificate in your name a signed letter of intent will need to be given to an MROA committee member at registration. That will suffice from the MROA point of view for now.

See you all there.


Posted: 26/06/2012 21:12:43
By: Chris M
My post was removed, as asked, due to a couple of inacuracies in my wording! However the gist of it was as follows.

There are now ONLY two boats outstanding certificates, 3402 & 3649. Please can you get these sorted before registration. If you fail to do so I have a form you can fill in there and then which I will send off to the RYA with cheque from you.

Please make sure that your borrowed boats have upto date certificates and that you bring, at least a copy, with you.

See you in just over a weeks time.

Oh and don't forget to update your bouyancy certificates, I am happy to sign off pretty much everyone who came to Whitstable!!

Posted: 27/06/2012 08:51:29
By: Jez3645
Thanks Stuart.

Posted: 27/06/2012 08:51:47
By: Jez3645


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