Topic : To A.G. re aquisition of vintage boat

No boat yet mainly due to necessity to deal with a minor medical problem. Nevertheless I went to Horning, Norfolk to look at a W & C IXb but didn't buy it. I started sailing on the Broads in 1946 so I had a lovely weekend wallowing in Broads nostalgia. 

Then I e-mailed Ian MacIver who was advertising a Chippy IX on the website but he never replied. I'd be delighted to hear from anyone who has information about classic boats for sale

Posted: 08/05/2006 20:18:51
By: Robert Harris
Apparently Rosser no. 999 is for sail in Bristol. a very nice ix, needs a small amount of work I'm told. I should be able to find contact details if interested.

Posted: 08/05/2006 20:38:56
By: Chris
Rozzer 999. Very interesting boat. Origionally built for Clive Curtis of Ranelagh S C. He more or less started postwar powerboat racing by organising the Putney - Calais races. Subsequently he was one of the founders of Cougar Cats, later his son Steve became World Powerboat Champion.

Yes I'm interested

Posted: 08/05/2006 21:08:45
By: Robert Harris
Meant to say - thanks Chris

Posted: 08/05/2006 21:10:20
By: Robert Harris

'Peppercorn' is for sale at £350!! Picture on Boats for sale list looks nice. Food for thought!!??

Sail no: 743 Design: Proctor? Builder: Wyche & Coppock?
Price: £350 o.n.o. Boat Name: Peppercorn Location: Nottingham

Good all round condition, has been garaged for years. Wooden mast (approx 8 years old made to order following and insurance claim) & boom. 2 Suits of terylene sails & 1 suit of cotton sails. 1 spinnaker. Good road trailer, renovated 4 years ago but little used since. Must go to a good home.

Still available 28/5/05

Owner: Tony Brookes
Email: [email protected]
Phone: 07774 788 125
01509 85 27 91

Back to list of boats

Posted: 08/05/2006 21:30:31
By: Richard Battey
have email a man how knows a man who knows the man selling Rozzer. Hope to find details soon. Will let you know.
She's at Baltic Warf in Bristol.

Posted: 08/05/2006 21:48:58
By: Chris
Rozzer belonged to me for a while after I bought it from someone at Bristol Corinthian.  I bought him (never had a boat that was so deffinitely mail) because he came with a couple of rigs and I wanted something for another Merlin - Djyn 638 (certainly a girl....if you were curious) that I was planning on re-building.

Rozzer was just the best fun Merlin I ever owned. Very strong boat, although I re-decked it, I never turned him over once in 4 years of ownership. The next owner strip and varnish the bottom.

However I have not seen Rozzer with the cover off for a couple of years so can not be too sure of current condition. Hull and decks were coated very well with epoxy, but this does not always last that long and it can be a real pain to remove/replace.

He does have a patched plank for which colour is a bit off, but it has been there a long time and is now rather part of the boat.

I was recently contacted by the owner who told me that he was for sale.

his name is Ted Fowler and Rozzer is in boat park of Baltic Wharf Sailing Club on Bristol Harbour.

email is: "Ted Fowler"

Good luck and do bring him to a CVRDA event, I would love to see Rozzer back on the water!



Posted: 08/05/2006 22:59:14
By: Ed Bremner
So that's 999 - now to find 888,777,666 etc as 111 is OK!!!

Posted: 09/05/2006 08:46:38
By: Garry R
Some more about 'Rozzer'. Geoff Worsdale owned her in the mid 60s. I have a photo of Geoff sailing her in the 1967 Champs at Poole, I'll send it to Mags to put it on the vintage photo page. 

All boats are she and her in my language.

Posted: 09/05/2006 09:00:27
By: Robert Harris
Here's a small picture.

Boats are always 'she' and 'her', but not really because they show any female traits (apart from being hard to control?), just because....

Posted: 09/05/2006 11:37:46
By: Mags
Just changed that for a larger picture. RH outdid AG in this case!

Posted: 09/05/2006 11:50:59
By: Mags
'she' or 'her'..........because we think (led to believe)we're in control!

Posted: 09/05/2006 11:54:45
By: john
Then definitely HIM is we're in control !! ;-)

Posted: 09/05/2006 13:06:41
By: Er (not) indoors
Re Garry R's comment yesterday about 888, 666 and 777. Here's a small coincidence. In 1958 Jack Holt built 'Cherokee' no. 888 for Colin Stokes, then of Ranelagh S C. The following year Colin's best friend, Clive Curtis also of R S C, bought 'Rozzer' no. 999 from Jack Chippendale. 

'Hellcat' no. 666 origionally belonged to Mike Astley. In 1957 she was the last Holt boat to gain a place in the first six at a championship.

I remember that 'Kingfisher' no.777 was an oddball and notably unsuccessful boat designed by P. Nethercoat.

Posted: 10/05/2006 08:39:37
By: Robert Harris
I am sure there is a famous picture in one of the old sailing books e.g. John Oakley's of Rozzer flat out on a 2-sail reach in the Hamble (or Lymington?) but despite a thorough look through my bookshelves I can't find it.  Anyone else seen it?

Posted: 10/05/2006 08:48:19
By: Andrew M
The two flat out planing pictures I have in various books are:
1. Robin Judah in Diki Diki a Proctor Mk VI
2. David Dyer in Shaxam also a Proctor MK VI
Both taken at a Faossil Bowl circa 1962 in a lotof wing the race was won by Keith Muston crewed by Ken Ellis in an Adur Mk 3 or 4.
Maybe that's what you are thinking of?
I'll scan them when I can and send to Mags.

Posted: 10/05/2006 12:51:37
By: Ancient Geek
In Eileen Ramsey's book dinghy days there's a picture of 222 at Henley. And one of 555, Little Jo. at Whitstable.  (C. end of 50's), Other merlins featured in this book are 859, 710,856, 794, 684, 218, 239 , 169, 214

Posted: 10/05/2006 13:53:36
By: Chris
Rozzer is also picture here
Either well in the lead or missed the start - all the other boats going in opposite ditrection.

Posted: 10/05/2006 13:58:20
By: Chris

Posted: 10/05/2006 14:31:11
By: link
number2005 is for sale on ebay

Posted: 12/05/2006 06:43:17
By: PJ
This also for sail

Posted: 12/05/2006 08:49:01
By: Garry R
Direct link for 2008

Posted: 12/05/2006 08:50:19
By: Garry R
Sorry 2005 not 2008

Posted: 12/05/2006 08:51:00
By: Garry R
Well Robert had 2105 once so not a major regresssion!

Posted: 12/05/2006 11:03:38
By: Ancient Geek
Thanks Garry

Yes A. G. and it's a Bob Hoare IX, sister boat to several Championship winners in the 60s.

I'm not familiar with how eBay works. I'd never buy a boat without having a good look at it even if I was paying only £50 so how do I contact the owner?

Posted: 12/05/2006 11:30:59
By: Robert Harris
She's called Hotpoint according to the year book so you could always ask the owner if you could take her for a spin!!  AND it's got side thwarts

Posted: 12/05/2006 11:49:58
By: Garry R
1111 was Ian Proctors last Personal Merlin I think called "Cumulus" which he sailed at the 1960 Weymouth Championships I think a mk 12 certainly built by Jack Chippendale - they - (Ian's 12's and MR's.) - were all "us's" 2222 was "Gigolo" A Rowsell built ????? Graham Pike but 3333 is too modern for me!

Posted: 12/05/2006 11:52:56
By: Ancient Geek
3333 is an NSM 2 called 'Precious' built by John Turner. Not sure where she is though!

Posted: 12/05/2006 12:29:25
By: Clever clogs
3333 is a Turner

Posted: 12/05/2006 12:29:56
By: Blackie
Last owner - one Douglas Pope of Tamesis

Posted: 12/05/2006 12:30:58
By: Blackie
Now will any of us be alive to see 4444 (Quadrophonic"?) the class no longer seems to grow that quickly they build em too well!

Posted: 12/05/2006 13:40:58
By: Ancient Geek
It will be a close run thing between 4444 being built and getting an old age pension out of HMG the way things are going!!!!

Posted: 12/05/2006 13:55:33
By: Garry R
We know about No 1 No 2 & 111. What about 11, 22, 33, 44, 55, 66, 77, 88, 99 ? Some must still exist?

Posted: 13/05/2006 10:53:50
By: Ancient Geek
In the 50s three of the boats listed by A.G. were owned by members of Minima Y. C. at Kingston-upon-Thames. 'Spray' no. 22 was a Holt built boat owned by Graham Farrington and 'Fay' no. 33 was a very heavy Wooten built boat sailed by Alan Phillips. 'Mermaid' no. 55 was sailed at Minima by Peter Halls and his wife. In the Year Book she's listed as destroyed. No. 66 is listed as not built.

I helmed and crewed many of those ribbed Merlins built before the Rockets joined us, they would have needed a lot of TLC to have survived so sadly I think it's unlikely that any have done other than the ones we already know about such as 1,2,6, 54, 111 etc. I hope I'm wrong.

Posted: 13/05/2006 11:43:01
By: Robert Harris
I can tell whoever needs to know that the Bombay Merlins which were untill last year in various atates of decay worm eaten fungoid growth etc formed the base of the Diwali Bonfire last December on the Hard at the dock by the Rpyal Bombay Y. C. So far the new secretary has not managed to sort the late J J Jehangirs archives which have photos of those Merlins in the 40's 50's. Tony Gough - Geoffry Saffery-Coopers very last crew sailed in them I do know.

Posted: 13/05/2006 15:42:46
By: Ancient Geek
Whats the problem with buying a boat blind for £50, you can get some great bargins on e-bay for that.  I would however neaver buy a boat for more then a £1000 without seeing it!

Posted: 13/05/2006 17:58:03
By: russhopkins3374
I only have a tiny garden, not enough room for a bonfire.

Posted: 13/05/2006 18:00:58
By: Robert Harris
Of the ribbed boats that still exist there's 36, 42 ( or is it 43)is for sale on the website,- - hope it does find a good home. I gather no 8 is being restored. There was a ribbed rocket on boats and outboards last year, 345 or round abouts, and another reasonably sound ribbed rocket went on ebay. a few other appear at vintage meetings but it would be good to get a proper trace on them all ( I'm sure Mervyn knows of severaL).
No 54 does not exist now. I was give all the fittings, cotton sails, rudder, centreboard, and boom, most of these went into restoring 36. The boat was severly damaged in a flood in th e50's, and ended up a child's sandpit until the grim reaper had his way.
Any one know of some more ribbed ones around?

Posted: 13/05/2006 19:43:26
By: Chris
Re my last message. What would be the point of me committing myself by paying £50 for what might turn out to be a 'winter project' boat. I did all my boatbuilding 40 to 50 years ago. Finding myself owning a boat like that now would be an embarrassment

Posted: 13/05/2006 19:54:40
By: Robert Harris
Come on Robert buy Rozzer! If she's still varnished then there's nothing to hide. New Mast new sails and your your own father's brother!

Posted: 14/05/2006 15:55:01
By: Ancient Geek
I bought 111 sight unseen on ebay for £200ish - must have been mad but then it runs in the family.  One empty wallet and a lot of work later I still think I am mad but hey she looks lovely and they aren't making them with ribs anymore and on ebay if you bid £5 over the last guy there is every chance you'll get the same again if you don't want her in the end.  Having said that I will be unlikely to restore another - two is enough.  One for sailing every week and the other for high days and holidays.

Posted: 15/05/2006 08:36:52
By: Garry R
Yeah. Taken my eye of the ball a bit, spending too much time on this forum maybe! Also I'm writing an article for the magazine about Minima Y.C. in the 50s and 60s which might please at least one of the regular contributors to this forum. 

Today I'll e-mail the owners of 743 and 999, I promise.

Posted: 15/05/2006 08:50:07
By: Robert Harris
Robert, buying off ebay doesnt mean you are not allowed to visit the boat and have a look! The owner can even remove the auction if no-one else has bid, and you buy it on the day.

Posted: 15/05/2006 09:49:15
By: Mags
Occasionally you get a good'un on ebay that is worth a bid, but generally the majority is only good for starting fires, and even then it doubt the wood would catch it's so damp and rotten.

If I was going to buy another Merlin I would go to someone who knows alot about the class, the boat and sailing!

I don't need to tell Rob this as he has many years of experience sailing Merlin's.

I do get frustrated though when people put boats on ebay accompanied with the word " Merlin Rocket. A fast boat with an active class" very correct in this respect with a photo of a pile of C**P with a cover on hiding all the ROT. Of course you do have the chance to view and/or pull out btu heck doesn't that defeat the object of Internet/Virtual shopping?

Anway it's Monday. I hate Monday's and got that off me chest.

Good luck with your purchase Rob, what ever number it may be.

Posted: 15/05/2006 10:44:44
By: Richard Battey
Be sure to include the big water fight Robert! 63-4ish?

Posted: 15/05/2006 10:54:09
By: Ancient Geek
Thanks Richard, I agree. The ex-eBay boat I saw in Horning was like that and they thought it was worth £700! I let them down gently.

When I do eventually find the right boat perhaps I'll give a big party for all of you who've been so helpful in my quest. At Salcombe maybe.

A.G. What big waterfight? Remind me of some details please. I was a married man by then and was a brand new father in 1964, I might have had other things on my mind.

Posted: 15/05/2006 12:39:11
By: Robert Harris
Yes you were a father in 1964 though somewhat after the after the water fight I'd guess about 11-12th October simply because it was two days after my 21st Birthday Party and I got the blame for it being early - all that bopping on the dance floor.- It would have been a hot day in 1964, Minima had a new lauch (well new to Minima) and the old tin job, Robin Fowler was driving the new one and we threw so much water about (Sue Harris Then Vines) Colin and Margaret Stokes and you me and a cast of if not thousands tens had a super time we had to bale the launch by bucket several times. It may have been '63. For once memory fades! Richard Mossip remembered it and in one of our conversations when he was dieing recalled it with a smile. I think you were Cadet Captain at the time too. Quell Example!

Posted: 15/05/2006 16:31:43
By: Ancient Geek
AG, how is osea these days?

Posted: 15/05/2006 16:45:36
By: Spotter
My sister Jane was born on October 13th 1964, so the dates are nearly right.

Posted: 15/05/2006 17:16:20
By: Will Harris
apparently some people say it's quite difficult to get to Osea, but I bet it's Child's play!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted: 15/05/2006 17:56:38
By: Spotter
Now for sale

Posted: 16/05/2006 08:28:07
By: Garry R
come on AG step up to the mark! is it true you can only get off Osea at low water, its a nice drive to Burnham though but I understand you haven't been seen there for some years.........hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Posted: 16/05/2006 09:14:52
By: Spotter
The Year Book says she's a Proctor MK VIII called 'Desparation'. I crewed for Robin Judah in his MK VIII 'Mint Julep' No.599 in the Rye Harbour S.C. 'Conquerer's Pint' race probably in 1955. We had just won the RAF Championship in Fireflies at the Welsh Harp but we couldn't repeat the performance at Rye. I remember we were painfully slow to windward in the light breeze but passed lots of boats on the runs to finish around 5th. I was very much in th Jack Holt at the time and wasn't impressed.

Posted: 16/05/2006 09:38:37
By: Uncle Robert
Oh dear, another Senior Moment. In my message just now I meant to change my name back to Robert Harris and to say "I was very much in the Jack Holt camp at the time" but it somehow got away from me before I'd finished.

Posted: 16/05/2006 09:46:14
By: Robert Harris
To A.G. More Senior Moments because I don't remember anything about that water fight. I already have another water fight in my Minima article and apart from minor revisions I've completed the text. Why don't you reveal yourself and write more about your memories of those happy times

Posted: 16/05/2006 09:55:56
By: Robert Harris
Robert look in the comments above you, he's disappeared because he's been busted. not for the first time!!

Posted: 16/05/2006 10:32:56
By: Spotter
"Short stories from a tall yachtsman" is in edit mode with the publisher, so your suggestion is prescient.

Posted: 16/05/2006 11:45:46
By: Ancient Geek
Ahhh yes Spotter - Richard Mossop must be the clue.

Posted: 16/05/2006 12:56:01
By: Robert Harris
no wrong answer, it's Childs play my friend

Posted: 16/05/2006 13:55:40
By: Spotter
Corinthians 1 Ch 1 v 1-15

Posted: 16/05/2006 14:44:42
By: Ancient Geek
Paul called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother, edit 

2: Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's: edit

3: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. edit

4: I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ; edit

5: That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge; edit

6: Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you: edit

7: So that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ: edit

8: Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. edit

9: God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. edit

10: Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. edit

11: For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you. edit

12: Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. edit

13: Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? edit

14: I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius; edit

15: Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name. edit

Posted: 16/05/2006 14:56:01
By: Spotter
Sorry typo Corithians 13. 1-15

Posted: 16/05/2006 15:03:53
By: Ancient Geek
Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. edit 

2: And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. edit

3: And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing. edit

4: Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, edit

5: Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; edit

6: Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; edit

7: Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. edit

8: Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. edit

9: For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. edit

10: But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. edit

11: When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things. edit

12: For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. edit

13: And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity. edit

I guess you spent some time reading...........................

Posted: 16/05/2006 15:29:20
By: Spotter
is it DVC ?

Posted: 16/05/2006 15:43:44
By: I think I guessed
Is this a misprint?  Should it read varnish away?  If so it is HE who has the same brush he has used for 30 years (I recall a posting from long ago!)

8: Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish (?) away.

Posted: 16/05/2006 15:49:46
By: Garry R
Have they all gone mad!!

Posted: 16/05/2006 16:30:33
By: The Judge
So there we have it..............a secret no more!

Posted: 16/05/2006 16:51:32
By: Spotter
Thank you! The scales are removed from my eyes! Ancient Geek is Lord Lucan!

Posted: 16/05/2006 22:19:07
By: Nowhere near as ancient
Lord Lucan never went to Osea Island but DVC did, apparently he was seen there in 2001 when a light aeroplane crashed there, claiming to be a resident  but maybe he was actually a passenger, indeed a fugitive, making a heroic escape from her Majesty, as did Lord Lucan himself ( Graham Hill allegedly at the helm ).
We will never know , you could write a book about this guy, "Tall stories from a short man"

Posted: 17/05/2006 11:34:25
By: Historian
No, no matter how much the cover may or may not be blown, (I’ll go so far as to say - “Close, but no cigar!”) 
I’ll defend the use of a nom de plume. English literature and journalism are littered with these. A Merlin Rocket sailor -Berry Ritchie- for some years masqueraded as “Prufrock”, Charles Dickens was “Boz”, There are several others in the nautical world, Group Captain Haylock one of the founding genii of the Merlin Class was; “The Walrus”. There was “Taffrail” who wrote boys own stories about the Navy who was several people, Commander Jack Bower DSO., wrote submarine stories as “Klaxon” and the “Worzel Gummidge” stories as Barbara Euphan-Todd. Sir Arthur Quiller-Couch was “Q” and of course there is that frequent correspondent to the newspapers “Disgusted of Tonbridge Wells”, and in the yachting press “Harold G Twincy” and “Sir George Proteron”. Karen Blixen who wrote “Out of Africa” was Baroness Finneky.
There are lots of others of course over the last 500 years possibly even “The” Bard himself.
I point out to the previous correspondent I am certainly taller at 6’2” than he or she is!
But unlike short people, tall people aren’t size conscious, anywat before we get sizeist we are reliably informed that "size is not important"!

Posted: 18/05/2006 10:47:38
By: Ancient Geek
The Walrus was Paul (if you listen to 'Glass Onion').

Posted: 18/05/2006 11:55:19
By: Beatles fan

Posted: 18/05/2006 18:04:58
By: Ancient Geek

Posted: 25/05/2006 08:30:54
By: Garry R
Thanks Gary. She looks really nice in the photo, not sure about the red sails. Neither am I sure she'd be the right boat for Tamesis. She's a Proctor MK XVI which according to the design guide is a compromise between the MK XII and the MK XV. 

Robin Judah lost the 1963 Championship in his MK XV when we drifted through his lee in our Adur 7 on the last leg of the final race. I know I'm being picky but I've had a mindset against Ian's later designs ever since.

Posted: 25/05/2006 09:09:21
By: Robert Harris


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