Heads up ... having a real battle with CraftInsure over my insurance claim after Hakuna Matata was blown over in the dinghy park (smashing her beautiful gunwhales .. sorry Laurie) during the Parkstone winter series. Unfortunatly we are into the small print ......

General exclusions: (not all stated)
We will not pay for:• Claims unless Merlin Rocket, “3571” is securely tied down to the ground whilst left in a dinghy park.

... which was tricky with no tie downs ... now what they really mean is the boat should have been tied to the trailer  .. so beware and don't fall into the same trap and get tied down pronto !! 

Any recommendations for a listening insurance company ??

Andy

I have found Noble Marine to be very good. I would recomend them.

Noble are very good but very expensive, twice what Bishop Skinner charge.

My boat was blown over on the beach at Saundersfoot (With the trailer tied to it!!) breaking the mast. No complaints whatsoever with Bishop Skinner it was all tied up in a matter of hours.

Just to add further i think you'll find all insurance policies have this kind of exclusion on them unfortunately. What you're supposed to do if there are no tie downs and trailers are not permitted in the dinghy park ( most clubs i've come across don't allow them but may not enforce it) I don't know and may be worth asking. Tieing down to the trolley makes next to no differance.

I've no experience of Craftinsure, but I think you've just got to show them that you took all reasonable steps to make sure the boat was protected. I'm not sure it's reasonable to say you've got to take the boat away every weekend. Good luck!

The issue of tieing your boat down is fairly standard. Insurance is a joint venture between the insured and insurer. Therefore, if due care is not taken by the owner for possibly foreseen circumstances, then this will invalidate your insurance policy.
Some as a matter of interest, also require the mast to be unstepped during the winter.
BFN
Barnsie

Is "joint venture" similar to "partnership", i.e. it is actually only to one party's benefit?  I spent about two years arguing with St Margarets over the extensive damage that my boat sustained at Exmouth and dealing with their ever changing reasons as to why they shouldn't pay the full value of the claim.  Like most other people I eventually gave up and accepted their offer.  So when, several years later, they posted their nice new policy booklet to me with its massively expanded list of exclusions, I said no thanks and went to Noble.  Yes, it's expensive, but most people I know have had their claims settled by them with little fuss.  You pay your money and take your choice...

Bishop Skinner have been the cheapest for me for ages. The tie down clause is in most policies as is the "not to be left unattended in the water" clause - don't leave it tied up to a jetty at lunchtime!

I have had excellent service from Bishop Skinner over the last year, but have just had a letter saying they have now become someone else, presumably a merger or a takeover.

I had 2 claims settled promptly and easily, neither of which was entirely straightforward, the 1st when the thwart broke at one end at Salcombe in April the next when the side-deck and carlins came unglued during Salcombe Week again on a pretty windy day.

I have also used Bishop Skinner for a number of years with just one claim which they settled in full with no problems.

Bishop Skinner was established  in 1973.
In 2005 Stuart Alexander aquired Bishop Skinner, I recall there was a small hiccup in service whilst computer systems where switched over, but they resolved that.
In Jan 2007 Stuart Alexendar became a subsidiary of Venture Preferences. I noticed no change in service or prices.
In Jan 2009 Venture Preferences, as a whole, has decided to rebrand all its subsidiaries 'Bluefin', that is the letter that Andrew got.

I don't expect any change. I believe that they use AXA as their underlying insurances.

The only releationship I have to Bishop Skinner/Bluefin is as a satisfied customer, having had very low premiums, and on the two carbon mast claims I have had no issues, and they even applogised for the �100 excesses (which was always clear in the T&C)

I have also used Bishop Skinner for a number of years and find them very good. 

Clauses such as the "tie down" are, as stated fairly standard, and are there for a purpose.

Companies such as are a broker, not the insurer, which is actually  is Axa. If the insurer finds the overall performance of the broker's product to be unacceptable they may withdraw, penalising prudent as well as reckless policyholders.One of the fundamental principles of insurance is that a policyholder acts as uninsured - ie: you don't take reckless risks simply because you are insured for the consequences. Insurance is actually a partnership, or joint venture, between all the policyholders and the insurer, in other words,any policy is judged on the performance of the "pool" of policyholders - if claims paid exceed premium taken in then rates will rise next year and all policyholders suffer price rises, no claims bonuses only affect this at the margin. Shopping around may help buck the trend while you personally remain claims free, but if you do then have a claim you may then find yourself uninsurable. Most policy terms and conditions are there to protect all policyholders from the effect of forseeable events, as opposed to unforseeable events which is the purpose of insurance.

I insure with Bishop Skinner as they are the cheapest by far.  I have 2 Vintage Merlins and one Firefly with a total cost of £150ish per year and this includes a combi trailer.  No claims yet so reckon that I have coughed up for a carbon mast somewhere along the line but the great cost means I will carry on using them.  Any telephone dealings have been efficient and polite - very refreshing.

Well said Giles to put the record straight.

Just to mention, maybe you think it is foolish of me, but of the 4 carbon mast we have broken, I only claimed for the two most expensive repairs. The others being 'afforable', I didn't want to become uninsurable or increase the statistics adversely affecting the premuims for us all. I know others in the fleet have also taken that approach; too many claims affects us individually and as a community.

I won't claim unless it's more than twice my excess. I don't see the point in getting the insurer to contribute less than half towards the damage only to get it back off me come renewal time in all probability.

To be honest i don't find mast breaks particularly "affordable" as i don't think you get much change out of £500 per break (Mine was about £1000 but it made a mess of the spreader bracket too). Of course it does depend on personal circumstances, my point being that while if you can afford to fund these things yourself fine, but not everyone can which is why we buy insurance in the first place ;)

One was a seconhand mast I paid £300 for and sold in bits for £90. Not worth the claim. The other was a single break below the goose neck, no spreader damage, I think that was £300 or £350. You principle of 2 * the excess seems to be the formula that I have also inadvertently adopted.

I agree that as soon as you get a break requiring a mast track and spreaders the costs go over £500

Looks like what we need is the type of deductible used on some commercial plant and equipment policies, ie. instead of paying the first part of every claim, an "excess" one agrees to meet all claims up to a certain limit (usually, funnily enough, double the excess) after which, if a claim exceeds the limit, the insurer pays it in full without a deductible. Not common, these days, but any creative underwriters out there?

I'd like an underwriter that does a laid up insurance covering fire and theft whilst the boat is off the water for the restoration that's taking too long.

Most insurers offer building insurance to cover your liability when you have part paid for the boat so I guess they'd cover laid up ashore too.

Bishop Skinner / Bluefin have provided cover for a laid up Merlin for the year for about £27.00 - neccesary in case it causes damage or injury to others while stored at the club, or goes up in smoke. It's common with classic car insurers too...

Bishop Skinner also do rather good travel insurance for sailors ... most travel policies don't cover competition in any form except at an additional premium calculated on the highest risk band. Worth bearing in mind for when Merlins go to Garda ......!

From personal experience I've found Craftinsure to be brilliant (sorry Andy!).

From a SailSport point of view, ie supplying repairs and parts Noble are also excellent...I don't get much contact with other insurers as they all seem to deal through the insured which makes sense but does slow down the claim time from initial claim to being given the go ahead...