Topic : Can you help a possible newbie

Been looking for a Merlin for ages and need a little guidance....

1 - Are there registered PY numbers for 'redundant' designs. I used to have an old moth and one of the members had a list of approved PY numbers for each design, does anyone have anything similar?

2 - Would you go anywhere near a FRP boat that has been painted!? My usual answer would be no as what is the paint hiding, but is this common place in Merlins?

Thanks for you help


Posted: 06/05/2008 13:34:20
By: Supernova575
Here is one answer, follow link below.

There were some problems with the older GRP Merlins. The very oldest in single skin GRP (1970's) are not worth looking at as they are either too fragile or too heavy (or both). The Nomex sandwich Rowsell built NSM's from the 1980's had some problems with water absorbtion after damage especially to the bilge keels but in general have lasted pretty well though the wood decks can have some problems as does the joint with the hull. There were a number of builders using the NSM2 mould in the 1990's. Some were very good, some less so and all again tended to be on the heavy side. The paint job itself isn't a problem as long as it was done well but the question is why it is there and if the gel coat is OK beneath. At least with wood the problems are usually pretty obvious.

I'm assuming you are not considering one of the Winder FRP Canterbury Tales!

Posted: 06/05/2008 15:16:06
By: Andrew M
What about the frp Turner 'tales? Mine (3486) has a continuous problem of the gel coat flaking off underneath. It is a real pain, so this winter I will probably clean it up and respray the bottom 4 planks. Is that wise?

Posted: 06/05/2008 15:39:04
By: floppy toppy
Yup, forgot those.  There were about 12 of them and most had a good record and several if not all have been painted.

Posted: 06/05/2008 16:27:19
By: Andrew M
Most of Jon Turners FRP CTs will have been painted by now. The trouble with gelcoat is that it needs to be polished regularly to keep it nice. Too many polishes and you're through and it looks awful. You'll never colour match a gelcoat repair either due to UV exposure.

On a nice looking boat of that kind of age paint is really to be expected in my opinion. Anything to worry about will be clearly visible through the paint.

Posted: 06/05/2008 18:00:45
By: Chris M
Cheers folks I feel a lot better now. Any problems with water take up if I leave it till the winter?

Posted: 06/05/2008 19:54:16
By: floppy toppy
As long as the glass isn't perforated then no. The gelcoat is there for aesthetic reasons protection from UV for the resin. It's not structural.

Posted: 06/05/2008 20:02:47
By: Chris M
Oh, and i'd pain the whole lot if i was you. You'll be suprised at how obvious it is once done.

It will need priming with plastic primer first too.

Posted: 06/05/2008 20:04:46
By: Chris M
thanks for replies to date, all good stuff. The boat itself is 3519 so guessing late 80's! It is an nsm2 built by bagley/ovington.

If anyone has any info on this i'd appreciate it. I understand she is lying at cookham.

Posted: 06/05/2008 20:18:57
By: supernova575
just having a quick look at the handicap guide. Seems a bit unfair? A 30 year old boat could have a py adjustment of only 20 points.

Is a 30 year old boat still as quick as a phantom?

In reality how much slower is an nsm2 than a new top spec tales? 3/4 minutes an hour?

Posted: 06/05/2008 20:27:12
By: supernova575
Where are you planning on sailing it?

On restricted water a well sailed II with a good rig and decent sails should be able to hold it's own. On open water they will be OK to windward but are totally outclassed offwind especially in planing conditions.

Posted: 06/05/2008 20:57:51
By: Chris M
Brain Salad surgery was at Hampton for a while, owned by Rob Heath initially and he did well in it but became dissatisfied with the boat's performance after weighing it in the Whitstable champs in 2002 (though he had been quite happy with it till then).  Most recently owned by Kevin Anderson and sailed at Hampton till last year.  the boat must be strong enough as I crewed for him on a windy day and we had over 30 stone hiked out at some points.  We also tested the buoyancy and it works.  Unless something bad has happened to the boat since it is a sound boat which needs some tidying and attention to the fittings to make everything work 100%, but the present owner may have done this.  Though significantly overweight this really doesn't matter for a starter Merlin and it won't fall to bits.  It gives you a lever to get the price down!

Posted: 07/05/2008 09:25:00
By: Andrew M
andrew m, thanks.

I'm interested at how much over is 'significantly overweight' !? How good is you memory? I'm guessing it is even more overweight now with 6 more years of water taken on and countless numbers of coats of paint!

Posted: 07/05/2008 14:38:29
By: supernova575
3520 - a plastic NSM2 built by David Ovington, is currently being raced very successfully at Tamesis by Jon Redding who previously sailed Fireflies.  He won, I believe, last Sunday and is usually in the top three in club races.  The boat looks pretty serviceable, and with new Rowsell sails, seems to go very well.  If it is of a similar weight to 3519, it doesn't seem to be to the detriment of its performance.

Posted: 07/05/2008 17:17:23
By: Richard (3233)
I have a feeling it was at least 8kg but I can't remember exactly.  I doubt it has actually put on any more.  I wouldn't actually get too hung up about it as the boat actually goes pretty well and looking at the ad there has been a lot of work done on it since I last saw it.  But it is a negotiating ploy.

Posted: 07/05/2008 20:42:32
By: Andrew M
I can tell you that the boat is now at cookham and is in sound condition and pretty tidy too. It has a nice new carbon rig on it aswell. 

It goes pretty well. We have a number of these NSM2's and it goes as well as the others. I had one for a while and it was heavy when I weight in and the champs but it went like stink on the river!!!!

I would highly recommend then as perfect starter boats or for any restricted water sailing. They can be a bit overpowered when in proper open water and waves unless you have 30 stone on board!!

Posted: 07/05/2008 20:58:24
By: Jez3550


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