Having just purchased 3442 'Armed Forces', I need a lifting rudder. I'd prefer to buy secondhand, but what should I be looking for? what size do I need for a Canterbury Tales, and what are the merits of the various shapes I have seen? |
You are right, rudders are not significant in weather helm , significant factors are the centre of effort of the rig versus centre of effort of the c/board. |
I would agree with Alan. It would be worth the expense unless you can buy one secondhand. You never know wht the thread may throw up. After buying such a boat, it would need justification and so would, if myself, only consider the carbon lifting rudder. The other benefit is, you know it will always retain value as others will be looking for them in the future. |
Ive seen 400 rudders on the back of merlins, mainly at salcombe,but they are not the lightest piece of kit,not sure if they fit the jt spacings though. |
Hi, |
How does the Winder stock manage to keep a lifting blade as firmly fixed as a fixed blade? |
I have always found that the winder lifting rudder stalls out when in heavy breeze. But saying that me and matt are not having this problem with his maybe they have changed abit from the earlier rudders. |
To answer Mags quetion, Winder use a break-away cleat to hold a downhaul rope on the rudder and it works very well. I shattered my lifting rudder blade into three sections last year during the training at Rutland when the CV or similar stock failed to lift as we were coming ashore. An expensive purchase but very much worth it. |
I have had (still have one for that matter) a series of CV stock rudders and without fail the blade has come up. I did have a break-away cleat and hold down line on the last but even so the blade would come up a bit in vigorous conditions generally on a spinny reach in waves and it is nigh on impossible to keep control without a vertical rudder blade. Despite removing the transom on at least a couple of memorable occasions I have stuck with the fixed, one less thing to go wrong. The Winder stocks are properly engineered and do actually work though. |
Unfortunately my home club has fairly shallow tidal water, a fixed rudder is just not an option. Sounds like I'd better start saving up for a Winder stock and blade. In the meantime I might be able to use the rudder from the 400, but they're not the strongest, the blade is a very thin skin of glass. I'll need some light weather to learn a new boat anyway. |
From memory James Davies bought Armed Froces one of Linton Jenkins carbon fixed rudders. Pat and I used one on Cool Cookie when it breezed up as we felt it gave a little more control, very nice bit of kit. |
I have a fixed winder rudder that i would sell. |
When you are rocking about in F6 and a bit of swell after rounding Blackstone and putting the kite up you will find out why JT made his fixed rudders as deep as that. I'd hang onto it for open meetings, the current Winder fixed rudder is a pretty similar shape though it adds a delicate little beak on the end for control of the tip vortex |
I've picked up a second hand lifting rudder for 3381, Seventh Wave, a Jon Turner MSN4. I intend to use this on the Thames, but I'm definitely keeping my original Jon Turner fixed rudder for open water. |
I don't think the downhaul rope is the key to making a good lifting rudder. Isn't the crucial element a pair of cheeks that keep the blade rock solid? |
I have just had my Winder Lifting rudder to pieces and the blade is such a good fit in the stock that I could bearly get it out. It really is a good peice of engineering (if you can call it that). Having hit the ground a couple of times with a fixed rudder I would not go back particularly since my Winder Lifter does not come up or move even without the string in the cleat. |
Do Winder's have a website? for some reason I can't find it! |
How much longer is a JT rudder than a winder one, if it's not a daft question? |
A "Wicked" looking lifting rudder. |
I don't think they have a website. You can call them though on 01535 604980 and they can point you in the right direction. Otherwise you might find pictures on the pinnell and bax website as they retail them I think. www.pinbax.com |
Wicked's rudder is a Laurie Smart one in a standard Winder Carbon lifting stock, stayed down well in Salcombe last year and no noticeable cavitation |
link http://cid-9cb8437dafd21555.skydrive.live.com/browse.aspx/merlin%203708 |
No Winders don't have a web site. I guess they are too busy building great boats to worry about that. |