MERLIN ROCKET FORUM

Topic : Used late Merlins

What a lack of later Merlins for sale. The most expensive boat is £4,000 I would like to order a new one but not prepared to wait for two years.
I do hope that some of the boats on order will generate a release of used boats in the 5-10 K region. If you are one of the fortunate people getting a new one soon and you want to sell your boat please feel free to contact me.


Posted: 10/03/2008 23:03:12
By: Rocket 0_1
I'd place my order now, the waiting list is only going to get longer while you think about it.  If you bail out your slot must have a value ...


Posted: 11/03/2008 07:47:07
By: David
Was told at Ally Pally by someone one the stannd that he had spoken to Dave & that a new Winder could be obtained this season which I contested and was assured I did not know what I was talking about ! what is the true wait ?


Posted: 11/03/2008 10:37:43
By: .
It was not Alex he was excellent and enthusiastic with his advice !


Posted: 11/03/2008 10:47:02
By: .
Well I spoke to Mr Winder at the show, and he said it was possible to get one at the end of this year, though we are looking at 2009 to replace Midnight Flight.


Posted: 11/03/2008 10:49:42
By: Rich3681
Early 2009 I think.


Posted: 11/03/2008 10:50:06
By: hywel jnr
Barnsie states his boat is due Feb 09 is that his choice or the true wait ?


Posted: 11/03/2008 10:57:33
By: .
It was our choice as we will be busy with the B14 Worlds in Hobart up to the end of January.
We could have had delivery in November I believe if we wanted it but since then there have been a number of orders.
Best check with Dave. For those looking to order, we have a new form come through 10 days ago and the price has gone up £500 due to additional costs in materials etc!
Looks more and more that there is a reason for a second builder who delivers a comparable product on time that is up to speed.
Oh I can feel a new thread coming on.


Posted: 11/03/2008 12:37:34
By: Barnsie
So whats the lead in time on a Ticket to Ride ? Think they are more money than a Winder is this right ?


Posted: 11/03/2008 15:45:19
By: .
Think they are competitively priced to be about the same.


Posted: 11/03/2008 15:57:31
By: hywel jnr
Is a Ticket to Ride just a glass version of a Let It Ride or have there been tweeks to the hull as well?


Posted: 11/03/2008 16:13:32
By: Grump
Believe very similar to the Let it Ride.
Call Lynton and you may be able to get one quite quickly, who knows. Think there is a slight problme though with the fitting out which is done by Kevin, but there is nothing to say you could just buy the hull and foils and fit out yourself. Must be worth a call to Full Force.
Bye for now


Posted: 11/03/2008 16:17:57
By: Barnsie
Glass ? Surely FRP presume carbon decks as well . Are they fast ? Let it Rides were inconsistent in shape were they not .


Posted: 11/03/2008 16:21:38
By: .
I wouldn't say they were inconsistant, but there were tweaks asked for by a couple of clients.

Either way 6 out of the 9 built have recorded top 6 champs finishes so they are consistantly fast if nothing else!


Posted: 11/03/2008 16:32:48
By: Chris M
Great lets hope we see more of them !


Posted: 11/03/2008 16:38:46
By: .
The mould for Ticket to Ride was taken from 'Gangsta's Paradise' Phill Kings Championchip winning Let It Ride and now Dan Alsop's boat.
The bow on Ticket was dropped just like the MK 4 winders.


Posted: 11/03/2008 16:50:57
By: hywel jnr
Was the centreboard case not moved forward slightly too?
I would say that the LIR is every bit as fast as a Winder Tales and even more so in the right conditions. there are stil 10 year old LIR in the top five of events even now!!

You could always order a hull from Linton and get Speed or P&B to fit it out. I doubt there is anything Tom or Taxi would not know about fitting them out!


Posted: 11/03/2008 17:16:21
By: Jez3550
FOR SALE EZ ROLLER , new sails,new boom, new poles, new rudder, new covers, new trolley, re-roped, comes with compass and brand new gasket and polished foils. has been back to kevin's shed over the winter for some love, can be viewed there. Absolutely ready to go £9750.00


Posted: 11/03/2008 17:16:35
By: over-commited
Why sell having just spent all that money on her ??


Posted: 12/03/2008 12:22:27
By: WVN
He has a very short attention span!


Posted: 12/03/2008 12:23:50
By: Hornblower
And money to burn by the look of it !!


Posted: 12/03/2008 12:38:27
By: WVN
I've heard that the owner of Winder 3633 from Bolton has a new boat on order and he is sailing big boats offshore this season. I think he wants about £7500 to £8000; might be worth chasing up.


Posted: 12/03/2008 18:32:05
By: Stealth
How long before people start selling their orders pre-delivery like they do with special cars etc.?


Posted: 12/03/2008 20:29:45
By: ...
ok here is a bit of fun and please whilst the facts are true please treat is as such.

Facts - I have a build spot for a merlin that is about to come up but unfortunately circumstances dictate that i wont be able to complete (gutted) - I would like to start a healthy class precident, should i

a/ sell the slot to the highest bidder
b/ Let the slot lapse and ask Winder if they could kindly give my deposit back thereby allowing the correct next person in line to get their boat

Oops i think i gave my preference away. Votes please!


Posted: 12/03/2008 22:12:52
By: Hornblower
Sell the slot,(Depending on the contract you have with the builder -SBNF terms? - 1/3rd 1/3rd 1/3rd) or take delivery, and sell in a public auction immediately, Mid Blue would seem to be the equivalent of Silver in Cars! Note the moment you have parted with cash you own the percentage you've paid for so you should insure.


Posted: 12/03/2008 22:18:40
By: ...
If have paid a deposit; which you have; then you have the right to sell the slot.


Posted: 12/03/2008 22:19:58
By: ...
Can the deposit be repaid and we all move up the queue by a place please ? otherwise an unfortunate precedent may be set for people putting names on an ever lenghtening list to get a place for peace of mind and potentially benefit if they choose to.Any distortion to the true lead in time to a new boat may indirectly put people off joining the class but on a positive note will help maintain secondhand prices for existing owners. I know this has been stated many times but the sooner a new boat arrives the sooner a secondhand one is available to someone wishing to upgrade or join us .Perhaps deposits should be increased by the builders ?


Posted: 13/03/2008 10:05:36
By: jeremy
Surely irrespective whether a deposit is repaid or not if the boat is no longer required then everyone will move up the pecking order in so far that the boat construction has not yet commenced or if it has some lucky soul could get their boat this side of Christmas (assuming that the colour chosen is not too hideous and meets with the buyers spec). What one has to remember is that a deposit is a guarntee as a first instalment to the vendor to secure purchase of said goods and cover for any inconvenience/loss of earnings so whether a deposit is returned in full or part is purely down to the discretion of the vendor, so I wouldn't go holding your breath just yet!


Posted: 13/03/2008 10:22:44
By: Chancer
It's called the free market. City boys estate agents super car dealers etc do it all the time. One day someone will take delivery of his all singing all dancing Winder wonder and stand on the foreshore and say; "What am I bid"? Someone, sometime, will say £20,000.0; deal done. Inflation as well as market forces will take over, a second viable and credible builder is needed, excellent as the other bulders are one gets the feeling its only a hobby to them, they's sooner work on easier projects, the fitting out is just to much.


Posted: 13/03/2008 10:52:41
By: Dealer
Is the above EZ sold then?
Is the class beating a path to Beer?
Or is the class Winder fixated?


Posted: 13/03/2008 11:04:35
By: Question?
Yawn, doesn't this thread come up time after time?

Supply and demand people. The beckoning recession may change this and there could be a sea of Winders & Build slots on the website. Until anyone can make any decent money out of a dinghy class, there will always be 1 bloke who dominates the market and a crack head who builds a blinding boat, but never sells an awful load of them as they are invariably too busy enjoying the effects of resin.

Lets talk about something interesting, like, would a dog be recognised as a crew if used at an open meeting?


Posted: 13/03/2008 13:16:54
By: worship the wood
I think not certainly was not in 1960 Robin Beauclare who had one of the early Proctor Mk9's 710 "Sarah Jane" sailed at Ranelagh once in verylight stuff with his Alsation Dog as crew he was disqualified so next time he put his baby daughter in the boat and was not.


Posted: 13/03/2008 13:23:16
By: Ancient Geek
perhaps the disqualification was due to the Alsation not wearing a lifejacket


Posted: 13/03/2008 14:53:16
By: Crufts
Advertising Winalot and then being disqualified is not a good advert after all!!


Posted: 13/03/2008 14:58:27
By: Garry R
FOR SALE EZ ROLLER , new sails,new boom, new poles, new rudder, new covers, new trolley, re-roped, comes with compass and brand new gasket and polished foils. has been back to kevin's shed over the winter for some love, can be viewed there. Absolutely ready to go £9750.00


Posted: 13/03/2008 20:13:58
By: over-commited
I have just cancelled my order with Winders,for a summer delivery slot, and they very kindly returned my deposit in full. I toyed with the idea of auctioning the slot. I just didn't seem fair. 

Anyway I took delivery of my RS200 in two months from order, and saved £10k in the process. I can replace an RS every year for less than the cost of a set of sails.


Posted: 13/03/2008 23:56:10
By: Now an RS200 Sailor
You'll probably need to replace it too. What does it weigh? MOD's are very inconsistant in build quality. Still if you are M&S rather than Saville Row. Remember the Rothschild quote that he as not rich enough to buy cheap things. MR's are value.


Posted: 14/03/2008 10:42:53
By: ..
Come on "over-committed" please tell why you are giving up so easily ??


Posted: 14/03/2008 12:27:25
By: WVN
Because it doesn't carry weight? 20 stone according to the design guide?
Because he needs the cash, an entirely honotable reason.
Perhaps he has too many boats?


Posted: 14/03/2008 12:30:48
By: !TC.
I understand from Mr Winder that the order wait maybe negotiable according to other programmes in play.  The gross misinformation that seems to be around is unhelpful.  The current wait is approximately a year unless build slots become available and are agreed.  However, many purchasers choose to specify a delivery time well in advance.  It is best to work directly with Winders about your specific circumstances rather than upset others with incorrect info.

Whether a build slot is saleable or not is a commercial judgement by Winders not to be policed by MROA.

steve


Posted: 14/03/2008 14:11:55
By: CHAIRS
EZR comfortably carries up to 23 stone according to my research. Graham Scroggie thought he was too light for his a few years ago if i remember rightly.


Posted: 14/03/2008 14:53:13
By: Chris M
Perhaps there is a market for lightweight sailing gear just as jockeys use silks and very light boots and breeches, most of it weighs a lot.


Posted: 14/03/2008 16:43:52
By: !TC.
Perhaps if over committed didn't start races 10 seconds early the weight issue wouldn't be such an issue ... 

Perhaps if over committed did some real merlin practise in his new boat he might find some more speed ...

Why not put the toys back in the pram and get on with it. Don't be such a light weight.


Posted: 15/03/2008 09:37:52
By: wot not
Graham never thought he was too light with little Ben in the boat!!!


Posted: 15/03/2008 21:28:06
By: Sibling rivalry
He wasn't sailing with Ben when he said it.............


Posted: 15/03/2008 21:53:03
By: Chris M
Still seems to work.

http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/photos/?s=64&PID=26578

Posted: 16/03/2008 09:07:45
By: Mags
Has the EZR been posted on the for sale pages? Or is it a wind up, because The Boatyard at Beer do not seem to know it's for sale.


Posted: 16/03/2008 16:11:07
By: ??
Two Canterbury Tales have appeared on secondhand list - be quick !


Posted: 17/03/2008 08:48:11
By: jeremy
There are 5


Posted: 17/03/2008 14:14:56
By: ??
no its not for sale, but someone was complaining that there were no boats available and there is massive demand.by virtue of the fact that there was nothing in my inbox with reference to said EZ roller I would suggest there is a little bit of hype around. QED. ( and i think if you study the video you will see i was premature by about 20 seconds!!)


Posted: 19/03/2008 00:24:31
By: over-commited
I think there have been good boats for sail recently it's just they get sold before they ever make to the for sale list. 
I am sure you'll find that many of the people waiting for new boats have already given first dibs on their second hand Winder.


Posted: 19/03/2008 08:58:24
By: Hacker
A boats wanted list? Might flush a few genuine sellers from the coverts!


Posted: 19/03/2008 09:00:26
By: Idea for Mags
Just watched the video one of the more pathetic attempts at time on distance I've seen and then he messed the start for himself and several others too. Oops.


Posted: 19/03/2008 09:02:30
By: Idea for Mags
Yes it was a great start wasn't it - with tide under you and a pile of boats to leeward there's no way out of that one


Posted: 19/03/2008 10:20:06
By: Andrew M
If there are very few good new boats coming up for sale, build slots of over 12 month ahead. No new designs in recent years.

sniffs of stagnation to me


Posted: 19/03/2008 12:33:52
By: Worlsey
Interesting little item on ebay.   Saw this advert from 1952 promising "immediate delivery for your holiday"!!!!   Progress now means that if you wanted a new Merlin you wait about a year.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1952-Vintage-Advert-FIREFLY-12-DINGHY-FAIRY-MARINE_W0QQitemZ370034365588QQihZ024QQcategoryZ423QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Posted: 20/03/2008 11:01:44
By: Garry R
stagnation? how wrong! The problem is that unless "in the know" those new  boats become retrospective post sales.  Sign of exuberent health! We would love to have new boats: FIRM order and maybe capacity will be delivered.

new designs? where is the designer? maybe we have reached the level of our current expertise in hulls? Perhaps we have best practice? RGilbert has shown that the skill lies out of the boat.

Steady as she goes.

steve


Posted: 20/03/2008 19:39:37
By: CHAIRS

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