I just competed in quite a competitive event in 3 knots of breeze at Hampton , part or the Vintage series, and was blown away by the rampant cheating in the event. Basically we had a fair tide beat and foul tide run with the pressure from the left on the run, so can someone explain how the the guy that won, consistantly gybed gybed and gybed again without setting a kite on the run? to me it was blatent cheating..and the PRO even mentioned that they would be looking at it after the same thing was hapening at Tamesis the week before.You may say it was just a vintage event so who care but I can assure you there was more contact today that in any nat champs. Who is right......the guy that spoild the cheats day or the cheat...discuss

Did you protest?

Cheats only prosper when no one complains, if you had made a protest then none of the other competiter would have cheated in the other races.

Perhaps he was an Enterprise sailor in disguise

Yes, you can protest, but as a relatively new back of the fleet sailor observing the antics of the top guys at the front,it is easier to say than to do. You also risk being ostricised by the very people that you are asking for help.

The start line seems to be the biggest area of rule infringement. You don't see many 720's, just after the start, yet there are loads of knocks and calls. It should be down to the good guys to police themselves. Isn't there a new rule about sportsmanship?

It's not a new rule it's just very underused,though I can understand constant roll tacking to windward but gybing down wind unless it's a very shifty wind?

I wasn't there, but I have sailed a lot at Hampton in the past. Obviously, rolling, pumping and other activities can put you in breach of rule 42, however gybing alone is not illegal except as per rule 42(e) "repeated tacks or gybes unrelated to changes in the wind or to tactical considerations".

The way you describe the course, you were running against the stream with the wind comming from the surrey bank. The tide is generally slacker on the surrey bank, giving you about 10 metres befor you are in the strong stream. So gybing along the 'band' of slack tide is the right thing to do and legal - in fact if you don't do that you will very soon be at the back of the fleet.

Obviously River sailing is an aquired taste and there is a fine line between responding the the various bends and wind echos and stream variations and cheating.

Regarding 'bumps' and no one doing turns, to a ceratin extend this is down to the two competitors, if one decides they are in the right and hails 'protest' then turn have to be done or risk a protest committee.

Rule 14 say "A boat shall avoid contact with another boat if reasonably possible.", so if two boat decide between them that avoiding contact was not reasonably possible (no wind, foul tide) then there does not seem to be an obligation on either party to take the matter further. I am sure a rules judge may have another comment.

Surely any collision and at least one must retire or do turns, failing which one or both parties must protest or themselves be in breach?

I have always wondered about the methods of the river people and the reasons or excuses I hear for them.  It brings to mind the comment made about the New York Yacht Club race committee during the 1934 America's Cup. But I will have to leave you to look that one up and leave it to the various river club committees to sort out their members.

RE:>> Surely any collision and at least one must retire or do turns, failing which one or both parties must protest or themselves be in breach?

There was a rule a few years ago that said this. But the current racing rules don't include this anymore. "Unavoidable collisions" are OK. But ANY collision that results in damage can lead to the disqualification of the right of way boat as well as the give-way boat.

In defence of those at the Tamesis event, the run was very true and gybing on the shifts downwind was a tactical decision, as important as tacking on the correct shifts upwind, especially on the river.

But, obvioulsy gybing on a very broad reach (or biased run) simply for the benefit of gaining a couple of extra ooches and rocks is plain cheating... Protest and be damned (or if you can't beat em, join em)

Three choices - protest the rule breaker, learn how to do it yourelf or get someone ashore or in a strategically placed rescue boat to record any rule infringements on video.  The last is pretty simple to do - loads of camera phones have video capability now.  Then just reproduce the footage during the protest hearing.

One other thing about 'true runs on the river'.  Seemed to recall a few comments from Hampton on Saturday that the wind was very far from true or constant in any given direction - 'it was all over the place' is a phrase often heard in the Tammy bar on a Sunday afternoon. The wind also seemed to establish itself in one place, disappear momentarilly and reappear in another part of the river.  Gybing downwind whilst on a reach seems a logical thing to do in order to find a constantly shifting wind that, at least on the river, is extremely fickle.

My opinion from Hampton yesterday was not that "the wind was all over the place" - rather more accurately it was that "the wind has stopped and the burgee is all over the place."

If you claim to sail by the burgee, many many tacks and gybes would be permitted, supposedly to play the shifts. But I don't believe there were any shifts....just an abscence of wind, the wind going vertically, or the stream carrying us along at the same speed and thus giving zero 'apparent' wind.

My comment referred to Saturday not yesterday, when there was slightly more breeze.  It was also on Saturday that I heard at least one comment regarding unhelpful wind shifts complicating matters further. Another comment heard from a Hampton member yesterday was that if people are going to continually break rule 42 then perhaps it should be waived in circumstances like these for the benefit of the whole fleet (not that everyone is capable of exploiting this situation).  Most may say this is not sailing, but in order to get yourselves round a very difficult and labourious course, perhaps needs must.  Personally, I'd prefer events like this to be recorded on video camera in order to enforce the rule and prevent it being breached in future.

The RYA's Race Management Conference is on the 8th of December.
It seems likely that this "perceived" problem will be raised as a major concern for the Classes and Regattas where Umpires are not used.
If you have a view go and have your say, if you do not then nothing will be done! Meanwhile a briefing where "The Riot Act" is read may help too, assuming there really is a problem?

Where is the conference being held?

Presumably to avoid any democratic participation which is "what they do" the RYA does not give a venue or strart time, just a date.

This is a major issue and you either do something about it i.e. warning then protest, or join them

Perhaps we could have two events, side by side, one for those who want to pump/rock/ootch/ the boat, and another for those who want to sail by the rules. Suggest a 10 min difference in start time. Could also apply to Solos at Salcombe.

I am so pleased that someone has recognised and agrees with my own disgust at the "Pump for Pots" blatant cheating on the Thames. We deliberately did not sail this event because of disgust at the the cheating at Tamesis the week before.
This blatant flouting of the rules is particularly evident on the Thames - I have never yet seen anyone pick up a trophy their without pumping! 
We need to protest this rule breaking before it ruins our sport. Sailing is a self policing sport and relies on the honesty of the participants. If this cheating continues, the rules will have to be changes to counter this, to the detriment of all. Do we want the hassle and expense of finding on water judges for every race? Stop the pumping before it spoils our sport!

I just wish I'd dropped out and videod the racing at Tamesis in the windless conditions. Can anyone explain why the race leader's mast was constantly oscillating from side to side (when he wasn't tacking) whilst many others around him were stationary in the vertical position. His tactics of constantly moving in and out of the boat with great heaves to pull it upright were blatant infringements of rule 42 which his fellow club members, the race officials, ignored. We could have protested but how could we prove it without a camera?

The rules are there, what it needs is for one you moaners to stand up, be counted and protest, and or for the Race Officials to do the same.

Why not do something about it at the time if you are that disgusted, rather than moaning after the event.
It almost seems like sour grapes to this reader.

I do feel that I must say something at this point as I have won the Vintage series, sail on the Thames and actually finished second in this event. The comments on this event make me embarrassed to be awarded second and I do hope that Sandy's comments about those who win a trophy are not unilateral - you and I have sailed enough together in light airs and to my recall - its just not my forte! The Vintage events are taken seriously and I well know that thy are very competitive. However, they are often sailed in a 'gentlemanly' nature - I have just completed 12, 2007 events and have not observed a protest meeting. Most of the events are sailed under the very best of conduct and I believe some minor indescretions have been overlooked. Due to good 'flapping' conditions I was not able to make Tamesis. Competitors are often extremely reluctant to protest and I am guilty of this. I take it that the comments started by monkey relate to the third race and whilst reluctant to protest at the time I do think that those complaining could be more factual. Monkey, are you upset by 1695 - Stuart Jenkins or the trophy winner 2018 - Hywel B-Perkeins. I was second, did I upset you? Please say so publicly. Fortunately I was 7th in the 3rd race and must say that near the end I was surrounded by Nick Price, Berry Ritchie and John Bell, all of whom beat me over the line and I did notice how impeccably they behaved/sailed(all exonerated). I have sailed against them in somewaht stronger winds and they beat then as well! I don't think I was ever close enough to 2018 to comment although I did think that 1695 flapped furiously up to the line and I should have protested. Richard - you have a lot to say on this all of this! You were on the balcolny - if you are going to get involved - get involved! And no! I do not agree with your notion of let everyone flap round - Tamesis, you are partly forgiven!! 'Monkey' - why do people do this?
BEN MARSHALL - email enclosed.

PS. Pat - if you are clock watching, Sylvie has gone to France for a few days!!

On my two recent visits to the Thames both my crews were astonished at the apparent gybe/pumping going on.  I just naively said its the Thames way. Its probably habit as well. I suppose I should have called a protest but seeing the number doing it makes protesting somewhat intimidating especially as they are clearly doing what is acceptable in the host club's eyes.

I fear that if a protest is not made to stick, those who abide by the rules as they see them without recourse to law will not bother to spend long hours on the motorway and the congested roads to get to Surbiton/Kingston/Putney/Teddington.  This would be a shame.  

We have had two very still Sundays at Brightingsea where our tides are much stronger than the Thames current and except for assymetric occasionall gybing from broad reach to broad reach on the dead run we had none of the rocking and rolling seen on the Thames recently. I have a pre war Uffa King 12 which is a great boat to roll from side to side to create wind but I just don't do it.  Its against the rules.  I reduce wetted area and keep still.

A long, long time ago I learned to sail Merlins at Minima Y C on the Thames at Kingston. Then the club and the dinghy park were about 100 yards above Kingston Bridge. A further 100 yards or so upriver of the club there was 300 yard trot of boats moored off the Surrey shore. The channel between the trot and boats moored against the shore was about 20 feet wide. In little or no wind Minima sailors in Cadets, Nat 12s and Merlins became adept at roll tacking up that channel. The most expert of them was lightweight Brian Appleton in the first Jack Holt 'banana boat' 'Lucky' no.177 (see vintage photos) who could wriggle up there in a couple of minutes in a flat calm! There was occasional chatter about protesting Brian but it never happened.

There's roll tacking up the side of the river ("wriggling") to avoid the channel and there is blatant pumping, rocking and rolling with no apparent change in wind direction.  I do not, Ben, support allowing everyone to break rule 42 but was just passing on a Hampton's members suggestion of this as an option.  Also, Tamesis officials DO NOT condone such behaviour.  However, IT IS UP TO THOSE INFRINGED TO PROTEST! I will suggest at the next open meeting and probably at the start of our winter series that someone video periodically throughout our club/open races to record these infringements.  I also think it's unfair to target a club(s) on this forum as being partly to blame for this behaviour.  It's a self-policing sport - so why don't you moaners start self-policing and give the club officials and infringers a few headaches after racing!

Back when we were supposed to be having our summer I found myself out on one of the Jury Boats at the Contender World Championships at medemblik. Now the Contenders are one of the fleets that have voted to allow a break in Rule 42. It is applied by the RO when there is 12 kts (or more) of wind measured across the course.

Code Flag O is then raised and more or less anything goes. I say more or less - one can pump all you like, but not 'ROW' the boat. 
Now there is a counterview that once Flag O is up - sailing as we know it stops! The sight of people flapping their mains all the way down the leg, boats rolling, helms heaving away is hardly one of the 'great' spectacles in the sport.

But there is a huge difference between a Class voting to Amend Rule 42 to promote planing speeds down wind in 'marginal' conditions and a csse of letting anything go when conditions are at their lightest.

D

I was at the back of Sunday's fleet (& lapped by the leaders in both races) as well as spectator on Saturday when there was a bit more wind.  There were chunks of the racing on Sunday when there really was no perceptible wind at all and with a fair stream running the only way to make any progress would rely on driving the boat forwards with some form of movement.  I didn't think there was that much rocking and rolling going on but what the leaders were adept at was roll-tacking, and in the particular conditions of light wind against a foul stream short tacking up one or other bank was perfectly legitimate.  The rules do state that when roll tacking and roll gybing the boat should not be going faster at the end of the manouvre than it was at the start.  This is not easy to police.

I think the way that the leaders sailed was entirely expected in the prevailing conditions.  We could argue that racing should have been abandoned for the day, not just the first race, but is that really in anyone's interests?  A lot of people didn't sail because of the forecast, which proved to be completely accurate.  Those who turned up got something resembling a sail.  What to do?

I have been assistant race officer in light but not so drastically windless conditions before and have gone out on the water and warned sailors who are pumping that the race officer has power to disqualify them if blatant cheating continues.  This usually sorts the problem out.  But when there is just so little wind I wonder if there is really any remedy at all if we actually go sailing.  As Robert Harris points out earlier in this thread it is not a new problem and one of the reasons for older boats being such a force on the river is in the ability to roll tack and at the very least not lose way from the manouvre.

I think what shouldn't happen is that people end up getting put off from visiting open meetings at certain clubs as a result of observing cheating (overlooked or otherwise). We should all be trying to support each other' events.  This thread doesn't do a lot to promote that idea. Two things, I think, would clear things up a bit - protest the infringer if you are certain of the infringement (Tammy's club officials would always give full support to a genuine protest) and introduce video evidence.  I'd be quite happy to use my camera phone with video facility if not racing or loan it to someone else on the day in question if I was.

Having only ever done one protest (a flying fifteen who thought he was a JCB) it is rather daunting and you need witnesses and evidence. Had I not raced I would have videoed Tammy but I came to sail. Race officials need to be stricter - we sailed at Shearwater on Sunday in the same level of wind as at Tammy and there was no pumping or excessive roll tacking and a few of us were even disqualified by the race officer for paddling out to the start line - we didn't hear the 5 min hooter and you can't see the flags until you are out. 
Had three red Merlins sailing too, in a mixed fleet of about 12 boats.

Ben - well done for winning the trophy - you've sailed well and improved a lot too this year. You need to get away from the Thames more - look where your best results were!

Just for clarity, a boat isn't racing until its preparatory signal, so rule 42 doesn't apply on normal start sequences until the 4 minute gun (I accept the vintage class may have been on a difference start sequence e.g. 10 warning 5 prep), except in match racing where rule 42 does apply between the warning and preparatory signal.

I hope the race officer didn't over step the mark by disqualifying boats before he should have.

Knowing how much work goes into organising an Open Meeting, from scheduling it, getting people to attend it, catering for it, running it and buying the trophies for it, this thread is just becoming rather depressing.

I'm sorry Pat, but you really ought to have done the more 'daunting' thing and protest those you saw infringing rule 42 during racing, rather than criticise clubs and a whole river! You don't name those you say infringed the rule.  Without doing so and protesting them at meetings (daunting or otherwise), nothing will really ever change. I do agree that officials on shore should take a more direct approach to this and help enforce the rule - after all they're in a position to video these infringements and help knock it on the head!

"let he who is without sin, cast the first stone"

"Don't buy a dog and bark yourself!"

It's certainly not a new problem nor is it resticted to Merlins or the river. Many top helms in many classes are very adept at roll tacking, gybing and general pumping in all conditions. You'd only have to watch a Firefly or Enterprise light wind meeting to see exactly the same actions. 
I've also witnessed a lot of spinaker over pumping in marginal planing conditions on the sea by helms and crews who moan about Rule 42 "cheats" in light airs. Ring any bells ?

Point of interest...

If you do a roll tack and gain a good speed (contrary to Rule 42)and then continue to roll tack but only maintain the speed you went into the tack with. Do you only break Rule 42 once on the initial tack. 

Would this be more legal than a boat that tacks less frequently but gains speed in each tack ?

We were a fair cop - late as usual! And the OOD was a railway policeman so rules are black and white - no grey areas and to be strictly applied! Maybe experienced enforecement officers are what we need;-)

Please please have the courage of your convictions and protest at the time. Protesting each other for rule infringements is a good thing and should be encouraged. Can I recommend 'Paul Elstrom Explains Racing Rules 2005 - 2008' by Paul Elstrom which is an easy read and expalins the rules in simple terms. As a named suspect I would have gladly defended my position at a protest hearing however I never had the opportunity as no one protested at the time. I look forward to racing against you all at the next Merlin event.

Stuart,
As one of the group behind who watched you prior to the finish, and didn't protest, can you explain now what was going on? I have an earlier version of Elvstrom's book and it is excellent but out of date.
Nick

Let me answer the questions raised by the two faceless chappies,  monkey and observer, as I was there and sailed.
Race 2 was won by the grey boat who at the mid point of the race was last by a long way, he got one of those puffs that were occasionally coming in and took him quite legitimately to the front.
Race 3 I pulled away on the first run in a breeze, with my spinnaker set and drawing rounded the mark and was beating back toward the fleet with a satisfied smile on my face and wishing I had done better in the second race (I missed the first race) for there was no way I could be caught with that lead, or so I thought! When a quite strong breeze bought the whole fleet down the run and back up the beat and past me! Pumping or minor knocks on the start line had absolutely nothing to do with it, I was Salcombed well and truly.
I have to say that after the race I was genuinely pleased that the racing had been conducted with little or no pumping and was very surprised to learn of this thread. The most influential factor was th wind that came and went.
Obviously observer was not there so we will never know where or when he is referring and I have no comment on monkey other than next time put up or!!!
Yes we would have liked a bit more wind but I felt that a very enjoyable weekend was had by almost everybody.
The Saturday was rounded off in the club house watching the rugby with a great beer and Indian meal laid on, I will blame the SA rugby team for pumping also as they could not have beaten our boys otherwise

I did not think a Race Officer could DQ someone without a protest, unless for being over the line at the start, not sailing the course or a finishing infringment, or starting out of time where it was in the SIs. Have I got this wrong, how can the RO DQ someone for paddling?

See Rule 63.1. The race committee has to protest for rocking

Pehaps the moaners are unable to appreciate a well executed tack or gybe that maintains the boats speed and their normal manoeuvre that brings the boat to a complete stop ?

Blogger,

There is no need to get personal and for christs sake if you are going to make criticism of others sailing abilities atleast have the balls to post your real name!

This topic has been very interesting and highlights problems that unfortunately do exist within the sport, but as previous posts have said it is down to individuals to police such incidents if they exist whether they be right or wrong. Unfortunately all the time my ar*e points south there will always be problems rule infingement in one form or another.

Bloggers point is completely valid... and considerably less one eyed than some of the other rubbish I have been reading on this thread.

Apologies for not knowing your identity ITK, but why don't you reveal yourself seeing as you're beginning to get personal on this thread.  I agree that moaning about rule infringements on this forum rather than protesting the allegedly guilty parties is pretty pointless.  And granted, there is a whole load of difference between skilled roll tacking out of the stream and according to wind shifts (legal) and rocking the boat from side to side to induce greater forward momemtum (illegal).  Why is it, though, when people make comments in good faith (valid or otherwise), often with their real name attached, others (always incognito) have to wade in with insults?

Not insulting anybody in particular just pointing out that on many occasions boats have been accused of pumping etc. while executing a good "just " legal tack or gybe or responding to a change in wind strength. 
Obviously some helms & crews are more adept than others !

Interested - you are quite right a Race Committee cannot just disqualify competitors for perceived breaches of rule 42 etc without a protest hearing. I think there is plenty of case law on this

67 RULE 42 AND HEARING REQUIREMENT
When so stated in the sailing instructions, the protest committee may
penalize without a hearing a boat that has broken rule 42, provided
that a member of the committee or its designated observer has seen the
incident, and a disqualification under this rule shall not be excluded
from the boat’s series score. A boat so penalized shall be informed by
notification in the race results.

Then let's use it with the w/ends forecast, sooner rather than later, but I would like to think the officials were experienced and talented sailors themselves,and able to spot the difference, many no matter how keen, are not. Please this is not aimed at any one in particular just a reflect that "they that can do......................."

Dear Old Fart,
Thanks for the comment. My post was in relation to Pat (2121) who said he was DQd by the RO for paddling after the P signal. I do not think the RO can do this unilaterally without a protest. That's all.Thanks.

Never mind the paddling - somebody did complain (they got DSQ for infringing the fishing area and that's in club rules) and we admitted paddling and took the penalty. Didn't need formal protest and there hasn't been one at the club as long as I've been there. A quiet word from the race officer is usually enough. Let's do the same for pumping.

Please correct me if I'm wrong but  "when so  stated in the sailing instructions" is the key to Rule 67.  It is commonly in the sailing instructions if you have on the water judges and yellow flags.  If its not in the sailing instructions you have to have a hearing.

Anyway to get back to the main thread, in my experience, if you see someone pumping/rocking/cheating and you shout at them they generally stop doing it. If they don't you protest. Its up to us to police the rules.

I watched the sailing and it was really nice.

It was nice playing with the hampton kids.

I think that it is silly that adults don't post under their real names.

....woof!

So, Pat, you retired, you weren't DQd

Will be checking Club Sailing Instructions at next Tammy Sailing Committee meeting.

It is remarkable every body who finishes behind me is a super talented sailor at the top of his form and those who finish in front a very lucky rabbit!

“It’s better too be lucky than good” (an  Essex-inseam)

Here a thought. I was on one of those business ethics courses that are springing up everywhere, and they made the statement that 5% of the population are just plain bad, for instance in a shop every isn't a customer but 1 in 20 are actually trying to steal from you.

Try applying that to sail racing, and make the assumption that 5% are plain cheats, and the only reason for cheating is to be ahead, so in a race like the Nationals, where I came 60th, I could reasonably assume that at least 3 boats ahead of me got there by cheating. So really I came 57th!

Here is a true story, a few years back I was in a chandlers hanging around waiting for something and another shopper started chatting, he was a big boat sailor and didn't know anything about dinghies, but when I mentioned I sailed a Graduate he mentioned he used to work with a 1970's Graduate National Champion, the name rang a bell at the time, but I have since forgotten and even if I knew it I wouldn't put it in print being hearsay. Anyway, this customer was so impressed with the meticulous preperation the National Champion went to with his boat. He told me how he would take the floor stringers out and meticoulous route(?) them out underneath and carefully fill them with lead so he got the weight in the right place. Apparently this made his boat quicker than anyone elses.

I think he was cheating. (The rules in the 90's definately disallowed this, but I am not sure about the 70's)

I don't think it really matters what proportion of people intentionally cheat or otherwise, because there's no way of really telling/proving their intentions.  The point is more that where others perceive (vastly different than knows as fact) 'cheating'/rule infringement, they follow the proper paths within the class rules.  If that means making a formal protest, then so be it however daunted they may feel by the fact of doing this.  After all, it's hardly whistle blowing.

I'm facinated by this subject as I am sure i've been turned over on many occasion by people go faster by cheating. My boats layed up at the moment, so I cant sail, but I do have a very good video camera, and I just fancy turning up at some of these light air races and see whats happening. As I wouldn't be a competitor, could I still protest, or shall I just put the pics on a web site for all see , ie. name and shame. 

Apologies for keeping anonimous but if you know who I am, it would defeat the purpose!

As far as I'm aware, only a competitor or member of the Racing Committee can raise a protest. If you can be accepted as part of the jury by the race committee that's possibly ok, but it would need notice in the sailing instructions (IIRC).

It is always really difficult to police racing rules, the competitors do need to have the self-discipline - rather than imposed. I don't think there's been a real way forward on roll-tacking/gybing in the last 30 years - especially on a river where short tacking in slack water can be essential. Rivers also have trees which can do odd things to the wind - I remember seeing two dinghies collide, both on starboard close hauled (sails filled & pulling) - stem to stem.

I just can't wait to go sailing now big brother!

You'd obviously be welcomed with open arms by the Merlin Rocket community!

I should have said rabbits cheat too!

Hello,
I have been trying to reply for a couple of days, but as I work for the council the forum has been blocked! The RYA Annual Racing Conference is being held on Saturday 8th December at The Royal Thames Yacht Club, 60 Knightsbridge, London, SW1X 7LF. It is the ideal opportunity to ask the correct people on how the class should go forward with this issue, as it certainly seems to be a talking point. If you are not able to make the conference you can always arrange for an RYA Race Officer Training to be held at your club for the benefit of your members and other local clubs. 
As I see it there is a huge scope for both dscussion and learning, and eveybody has valid points, but they are sometimes being expressed in very personal terms which is not helpful to resolving the issue.
All I can can say is that I have only sailed a couple of the vintage series this year, at Frensham Ponds and at Sherwater. I enjoyed both days and have always found the fleet very friendly and communicative, so hopefully we can build on that, not get reduced to maoning about individuals.

It might be a question of "Education" and "Information" rather than "Discussion" as surely the rules are clear! 
Incidentally - on the information front what time does it start? AND can one just turn up or is it like so much else to do with administering our sport exclusive to the few and the very few?

Come on -, don't be shy. Just turn up unannounced for an early evening kick-off!

If you belong to a sailing club all the details will have been sent to your club contact, probably your sailing secretary. It is a 11.15am start, and they do ask you to let them know if you are going to attend, but I think that is more for the catering side of things as they provide teas/coffees and lunch. If you have any specfic topics you want on the agenda I think they like to know a little in advance to make sure there is time for everything.

I notice from the pictures at Hollingworth - the majority of the fleet at various stages of ooch (particularly after the start).  No cause for alarm, just top sailors getting the most out of their vessels in the conditions.

Where are these pictures? I can't find them on the Hollingworth website.

I think IO might have meant the Blithfield website if he was referring to the Inlands?

Actually I think it is Wembley, so understandable....

Eh!?

I over gybed at the weekend and had a swim!

Was quite windy on Sunday. Where were you?

On and in the Blackwater.

Sounds dark....

very green

.